Reasons Humans Are Doomed

[arthwollipot]

Actually, if it helps, instead of epiphenomenon, consider that I said emergent property instead. Since the definition of the former is contentious, I'll stop using that word. The alternate is not quite the same thing, but it still conveys what I'm going for.

[President Bush]

Oh, okay, I will assume you are not a zombie. Now a question:

Was the thoughtful reply to me that you just posted not a physical effect?

Again, levels. I'm not physically affecting my neurotransmitters when I reply to you, I'm physically affecting my computer.

Now you are contradicting what you just said in your previous post.

Epiphenomenalism denies physical effects of mental events. Isn't knowing something/saying something/posting something about what is taking place in your mind a physical effect?

Huh? No, you're mixing levels.

Not surprising you are confused with your definitions.Epiphenomenalism is a self-contradicting perspective.

I'll give it another shot... philosophical positions such as epiphenomenalism are come by via inference. Inferential reasoning is reasoning that is based on premises that are evidence for its conclusion.

Epiphenomenalism doesn't allow any of that. Even if epiphenomenalist arthwollipot were right, he'd be unable to know it.

Which is why I said at the beginning of all this...

Consciousness isn't that mysterious. It's just an epiphenomenon of brain function.

If that were so how can you know it's true?

[sparks]

Prez, FTW.

[grayman]

[Admin]

Brilliant!

[stanky]

Oh, okay, I will assume you are not a zombie. Now a question:

Was the thoughtful reply to me that you just posted not a physical effect?

Again, levels. I'm not physically affecting my neurotransmitters when I reply to you, I'm physically affecting my computer.

you're physically moving electrons when you think.
you can even affect where blood flows with thought.
chess is a high calorie sport.

what's wrong with free will?
reminds me of god vs no god.
what possible difference does it make?

it's a very odd division between people; one that serves no purpose other than contention.
we all believe the same thing; we just use different words.
we're operating the same physical meat machinery in the same perceptual universe.

we get to explore it to the extent that our belief system allows.
thank god science is experiencing a new renaissance of thinking. quantum mechanics is strange enough that it may have spurred more acceptance of out of the box approaches.

what we've learned about forests, quite recently, is outrageously exciting...and it was out of reach because we had no reason to look. To a human supremacist, it would sound like absolute poppy-cock. The suggestion of a mycelium network that acts like a neural network between multiple species, whom can use it to direct flow of nutrients and or pest deterrents to other trees, would have gotten a botanist fired 40 years ago. It sounds like mythology.

and of course, same is true in all fields of study. science carries its baggage along.
that baggage, imho, oddly enough, is 'religious thinking'.

example:

i have old science books that describe the negro brain. it was known to be smaller and less developed than the caucasion brain. this error stems from the white-centric background of science in general.
scientists also knew crazy shit about women and babies, that, thank god, has been debunked.

it's our arrogance, not our apathy, that has us stuck.

[grayman]

In case you missed it:

3rd person in custody over foiled plot targeting now-canceled Taylor Swift shows in Vienna

https://apnews.com/article/austria-tayl ... 416c0eb05f

[Admin]

These people won't ever give up.

How we deal with that I don't know, but I'm very glad they were stopped.

[sparks]

Oh, okay, I will assume you are not a zombie. Now a question:

Was the thoughtful reply to me that you just posted not a physical effect?

Again, levels. I'm not physically affecting my neurotransmitters when I reply to you, I'm physically affecting my computer.

you're physically moving electrons when you think.
you can even affect where blood flows with thought.
chess is a high calorie sport.

what's wrong with free will?
reminds me of god vs no god.
what possible difference does it make?

it's a very odd division between people; one that serves no purpose other than contention.
we all believe the same thing; we just use different words.
we're operating the same physical meat machinery in the same perceptual universe.

we get to explore it to the extent that our belief system allows.
thank god science is experiencing a new renaissance of thinking. quantum mechanics is strange enough that it may have spurred more acceptance of out of the box approaches.

what we've learned about forests, quite recently, is outrageously exciting...and it was out of reach because we had no reason to look. To a human supremacist, it would sound like absolute poppy-cock. The suggestion of a mycelium network that acts like a neural network between multiple species, whom can use it to direct flow of nutrients and or pest deterrents to other trees, would have gotten a botanist fired 40 years ago. It sounds like mythology.

and of course, same is true in all fields of study. science carries its baggage along.
that baggage, imho, oddly enough, is 'religious thinking'.

example:

i have old science books that describe the negro brain. it was known to be smaller and less developed than the caucasion brain. this error stems from the white-centric background of science in general.
scientists also knew crazy shit about women and babies, that, thank god, has been debunked.

it's our arrogance, not our apathy, that has us stuck.

In simpler language, science is self correcting even in the face of bigotry and other forms of stupidity. No Sky Daddy need apply. Further, our belief systems have nothing to do with our perceptions of the Universe. Provided we're paying attention and not getting all fucked up in what we want to perceive.

And I'd love to read all about how we're moving electrons when we think. Please show your source on that one stank.

[stanky]

at the synapse of a nerve cell, an electron jumps the gap between acetylcoline and cholinesterase? if i recall.
thought requires energy which implies digestion.