A very depressing video from Gaza

[arthwollipot]

We shuttle about; get conquered; explore; exploit...why get zealous about one spot in time?

Because it's a religious thing. "God gave this land to me" as the song goes. Israelis believe that they not only have a right to that piece of the world, they have a literal God-given right to it.

[Meadmaker]

Maybe we could give a state to the Israelis. A Dakota. Call it Zion.

Hitler wanted to give them Madagascar, but he couldn't work out the details, so he killed them instead.

Well, not quite all of them. But no one wanted the survivors.




My fantasy solution to the problem would be, instead of giving them a state, make it a state. The 51st state of the union will consist of all lands that are currently Israel, plus Gaza and the West Bank. Impose the US constitution on them. It would be like a new Utah.

[Meadmaker]

We shuttle about; get conquered; explore; exploit...why get zealous about one spot in time?

Because it's a religious thing. "God gave this land to me" as the song goes. Israelis believe that they not only have a right to that piece of the world, they have a literal God-given right to it.

That explains why the Jews think they ought to have the land. What explains the Palestinian feeling that they ought to have the land, from the river to the sea?

Their ancestors were thrown out more recently?

Therefore they shouldn't have to live around Jews?

If the Palestinians were demanding equal rights in a democratic society, I think international support would be much less for Israel. They can start by saying, "People really shouldn't kill Jews." and "It's ok for Jews to live in the land formerly known as Canaan."

Maybe we ought to tell the Jews to move back to Baghdad. There were a lot of Jews there in 1948.

Anyway, that's all related to why I found the initial video so depressing. Her life is miserable. The Israeli army is indifferent to her suffering, which is real. And the thing she wants us to not forget, is that it is our land, from the river to the sea. We don't hear anyone saying, "Why can't we all live together." She wants the Jews off her land.

Where would they go?



ETA": And....ironically, the leaders of the Zionist movement didn't actually believe God gave them that land. They were mostly secular Jews.

[President Bush]

Describing his own positive experience when he sought mental health treatment earlier this year, Sen. John Fetterman (D-PA) reportedly reached out Friday to a Gazan child who had lost his entire family in an airstrike and encouraged the boy to try therapy.

https://www.theonion.com/fetterman-enco ... 1850990440

[Admin]

I don't see things exactly like you expressed. I don't think the Israeli side wants to kill all the Arabs.

It appears to be their clear policy that Gazans are being given a choice, and the sad part is, it's a choice that doesn't exist right now: the people can get out of Gaza - and into Egypt - or die.

They're hoping international and moral pressure on Egypt will force them open the border, which is naive and disturbing, because the only outcome is genocide. Israel, with nukes aplenty, isn't challengeable by any other state, and with US backing, is impregnable and Egypt isn't capable of handing a couple of million people.

But hey, it's growing a whole new generation of terrorists, so it's all good - we gotta have forever wars.

[Meadmaker]

But hey, it's growing a whole new generation of terrorists, so it's all good - we gotta have forever wars.

Indeed.

And that was predictable.

I look at October 7, and I see a truly disgusting event. Really, really, bad. A massive, coordinated attack against primarily civilian targets. The people on the kibbutz, and at the dance festival, were not collateral damage. They were the targets, and with an attack that big, it's obvious that these weren't rogues. This was a governmental, i.e. Hamas leadership, initiative.

So what was the aim?

Kill Jews? Well, yeah, but that's kind of old fashioned. There's nothing special about that. Even with an attack of that size, they certainly couldn't kill all the Jews, so what's the point? Furthermore, they had to know that there would be massive retaliation, with thousands of their people dying. They knew that would happen. So why do it?

Because it would help grow a new generation of terrorists. It's part of the plan.

[Admin]

If you're able to ignore the limbs blown off babies and look at the "war" as an intellectual exercise, Hamas were smart as hell unleashing the attack.

They absolutely knew Israel would go all America on their arse and massacre thousands of people, and Israel promptly did exactly what they thought.

As well as growing a whole new generation of terrorists across the entire islamic world, they've also managed to turn vast swathes of the world against Israel. Whereas "Free Palestine" marches would attract a few hardcore followers, we now have hundreds of thousands of people turning up.

Someone's been studying Game Theory in Gaza and they're winning all the way.

[Meadmaker]

If you're able to ignore the limbs blown off babies and look at the "war" as an intellectual exercise, Hamas were smart as hell unleashing the attack.

They absolutely knew Israel would go all America on their arse and massacre thousands of people, and Israel promptly did exactly what they thought.

As well as growing a whole new generation of terrorists across the entire islamic world, they've also managed to turn vast swathes of the world against Israel. Whereas "Free Palestine" marches would attract a few hardcore followers, we now have hundreds of thousands of people turning up.

Someone's been studying Game Theory in Gaza and they're winning all the way.

There's something very disturbing about a world where deliberately targetting a dance party for death, destruction, and rape is a smart move.'

But it may very well turn out to be so.

But is it really? Have they played the game correctly? Have they set the objectives appropriately, or will they get stuck at a local maximum? In other words, support for their cause has certainly been more vocal in the past month than at any other time in history, so that's winning, right? Well, maybe.

The thing is, what's their actual cause, and do the people demonstrating in their favor understand it? When crowds of US college students chant "from the river to the sea", do they understand what they are saying? That phrase is actually starting to get some attention in the US press.

Some of them took up that chant in front of Rashida Tlaib. It got enough attention that she had to explain what it meant. You see, according to Rashida, it is for a land with equal rights and democracy for all people in all of Palestine. Well that sure sounds good to me. Yay! From the river to the sea, Palestine shall be free! That's awesome.

Except it''s bullshit. She's just plain lying. The actual meaning of the phrase, and the actual win condition for the people who chose to throw handrenades into homes on a kibbutz, is the elimination of the State of Israel completely, replacing it with a typical Islamo-fascist "Islamic Republic", where Jews are dead, exiled, or maybe a few will remain as maginalized subjects.

When these mush-minds at our elite universities understand what that slogan really means, and the real aims of the Palestinian leadership really is, will the support stick? I don't know.

[arthwollipot]

I completely agree with The Atheist on this one. The only way Hamas loses this is for Israel to kill every last Palestinian in Gaza. Which to be fair they do seem to be pretty well on track to doing.

[Meadmaker]

I completely agree with The Atheist on this one. The only way Hamas loses this is for Israel to kill every last Palestinian in Gaza.

So, how do they win?

That's a serious question. What constitutes "winning" for them, and how do the October 7 attacks directly or indirectly lead to a win?