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Venezuela
#1
What's happening in Venezuela deserves its own thread.
It is quite apt to become a critical component in the global power struggle, due to its huge oil reserves and its neighbors and U.S. history n the region.

Imho, the msm is doing a shit job of reporting on the Venezuela upheaval. 
It should strike us as strange that a person that is largely unknown and has never run for office is suddenly recognized as the new president there...and this is hailed as a democratic reform.

Greg Palast is a real journalist. He's done a 3 part interview on Jimmy Dore's show, regarding what he had seen on his recent trip there.

here's a segment:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gs-FiLFFDnk

There's a few other journalists that have chimed in about this. None are mainstream.
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#2
(03-07-2019, 10:00 PM)stanky Wrote:  What's happening in Venezuela deserves its own thread.

I'm a bit "meh" on it myself. I was thinking when I saw the subject that I'll make a list of all the countries in serous shit right now.

Venezuela's just one of them, and while it's closer to USA than any of the others, it's not in the same league as several genocides being committed right now.

(03-07-2019, 10:00 PM)stanky Wrote:  It is quite apt to become a critical component in the global power struggle, due to its huge oil reserves and its neighbors and U.S. history n the region.

Nah, Russia & China have sided with Maduro and USA will stay out, outside of feeble political manoevering.

Ever notice how much Maduro looks like Saddam Hussein? Same moustache. Not their only similarities, either.

(03-07-2019, 10:00 PM)stanky Wrote:  Imho, the msm is doing a shit job of reporting on the Venezuela upheaval. 

I thought you didn't watch MSM? If that's the case, how would you know?
Love is... that one person whose freshly-warm toilet seat you don't find disgusting.
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#3
I touch down with it. I'll even check in with Fox on occasion. I see headlines. We all do, I suspect.

Maduro isn't great, but he was elected. And he represents the majority of brown Venezuelans.

The squeeze is on from the west. The U.K. is holding their gold; the U.S. is holding back payment for oil...an otherwise wealthy nation is being sanctioned into a crisis, which sets the stage for a coup. The puppet, naturally favors U.S. concerns.
Canada is a player in this as well. Their gunky tar sands, via the xl pipeline, to Koch refineries in Corpus Christie, Texas, have taken the place of the oil that once flowed from Venezuela. Hence, they can't make money; therefore social unrest; then intervention disguised as charity.

It's an old scenario.

And Venezuela just happens to have the biggest oil reserves on the planet.
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#4
I'm a bit confused about all this, havent paid it enough attention perhaps, but is there more than bias at play when siding with Maduro? or is it only because Trump is recognizing the other bloke?
'Cos Maduro seems to me to have been playing despot and running the country into the ground. What kind of arsehole refuses to let in humanitarian relief in case it threatens his power?? Who da fascist here?

The power grid has been degrading for a decade it seems, along with other things. But hey, just wondering what the real gen on it is 'cos I'm really glad I'm not Venezuelan right now.

... I'm also worried about the policies of the Labor mob here that seem to mirror those of the Maduro government.
Sell the resources cheap, and keep the people happy with freebies the country can't afford until the lights go out.

https://www.npr.org/2019/03/11/702179263/this-is-going-to-end-ugly-venezuela-s-power-outages-drag-on
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#5
US withdraws all staff from Caracas embassy
"Who's with me?." - stanky
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#6
(03-12-2019, 03:52 AM)Di Wundrin Wrote:  I'm a bit confused about all this, havent paid it enough attention perhaps, but is there more than bias at play when siding with Maduro?  or is it only because Trump is recognizing the other bloke?  
'Cos Maduro seems to me to have been playing despot and running the country into the ground.  What kind of arsehole refuses to let in humanitarian relief in case it threatens his power??   Who da fascist here?

All I know for sure is that Chavez drove the economy into the ditch with some truly awful ideas coupled with runaway corruption, so Maduro didn't exactly inherit a good country and ruin it - he just had no idea and let things get worse.

I agree that stopping aid convoys is dumb, but then again, I've read reports from people living in Venezuela who say that the world's view is highly skewed and while times are tough, the majority are going about their business.

Albeit without toilet paper.
Love is... that one person whose freshly-warm toilet seat you don't find disgusting.
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#7
I was getting the impression that there was as much incompetence involved as corruption.

(03-12-2019, 10:43 AM)The Atheist Wrote:  All I know for sure is that Chavez drove the economy into the ditch with some truly awful ideas coupled with runaway corruption, so Maduro didn't exactly inherit a good country and ruin it - he just had no idea and let things get worse.

Sounds a reasonable assumption.  That's what happens when people panic and think that changing the driver will fix the car!  They invariably put an amateur into the driving seat and then wonder why the wheels fall off. 

I agree that stopping aid convoys is dumb, but then again, I've read reports from people living in Venezuela who say that the world's view is highly skewed and while times are tough, the majority are going about their business.

Albeit without toilet paper.

I'd go with highly skewed for sure,  but which skew view is closest?  All of them perhaps, it's seems to be a more spectacular clusterfuck than the norm.


But out of curiosity.  What would the members here do?  'Liberate' it?  Send in the US Army?  Blow up Maduro's office?  Carpet bomb Caracas?? what?  Is there anything at all that America could do that wouldn't be pounced on as a move to take over the oil??  

That was a comment that piqued my attention in the Beeb article ... this bit ...


"

Quote:Nicolás Maduro promised Venezuelans a better life in a socialist paradise," Mr Pompeo said on Monday. "He delivered on the socialism part... the paradise part? Not so much."But in a televised address, Mr Maduro blamed the continuing power cuts on foreign sabotage. "The United States' imperialist government ordered this attack," he said, without offering evidence.



Now that sounds like the ranting of a cornered nutter to me.  Attack??  Rusted out and deteriorating infrastructure due to lack of maintenance is negligence, not sabotage.

Reading further is this gem of info ...

Quote:
Much of Venezuela has been without power since last Thursday. This has reportedly been caused by problems at the Guri hydroelectric plant in Bolívar state - one of the largest such facilities in Latin America.

Venezuela depends on its vast hydroelectric infrastructure, rather than its oil reserves, for its domestic electricity supply.

But decades of underinvestment have damaged the major dams, and sporadic blackouts are commonplace.

So we'd have to delve into the reasons that they went with total reliance on one power source, for cost factor? or was it the 'renewable' aspect that drew the decision?   Whichever they neglected the infrastructure and if that was due to  "underinvestment" then they were obviously offering a flawed deal to the investors.  People wont give governments money without some pretty solid assurances that the investment will be protected. 

Still none the wiser, is Venezuela a victim of corruption or incompetence?  Is it 'Banana Republic' syndrome? 
Corruption Central?   or was it the "manana" syndrome, and tomorrow came with a wallop??

Banana or manana??
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#8
(03-12-2019, 03:13 PM)Di Wundrin Wrote:  Still none the wiser, is Venezuela a victim of corruption or incompetence?

Both. A grand marriage of quasi-Leninist policies with Putinesque corruption.

I'd bet my life there are lots of billions of dollars have left the country as US dollars long before the shit hit the fan.
Love is... that one person whose freshly-warm toilet seat you don't find disgusting.
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#9
holy cow.

I may need to explain the part of this that is missing.

I hardly know where to start.

Aid from the U.S."

That has always meant weapons in the past.
There is every reason to expect more of the same.

Unfortunately, we aren't much interested in typical, historic interventions the U.S. has used in the past.

We still don't recognize any of that.

If we did, we'd smell this from a million miles away.
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#10
So you don't think a South American nation can fuck itself over without help from the US??
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