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positive, negative; darkness and light:
#11
How timely, Sparky.

I was just looking at a youtube on the site "numberphile" wherein there were four or more choices that mathematicians used as a symbol.
Let me see if I can retrieve it....

here you go:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pasyRUj7UwM

(skip ahead to 1:09 if you in a hurry.)

btw, to any curious geeks out there (imaginary lurkers) the link is a part 2 of a particular nerd-fest.)

btw, part 2:
I really don't enjoy the process of digging thru stuff to prove an obscure point I'm making.

In fact, it happened a few days ago here, when T.A. made some weird blanket statement (forgive me for not recalling it word for word) that asked something like "show me one example wherein math solutions come up with multiple solutions that are contradictory.
One of the reasons I chose not to crush his argument was that there were too many choices of examples for me, and it simply wasn't worthy of my time. If he's here, and can recall this moment, I will be glad to oblige.

Back on topic:

Di, I could try to simplify all that for you, if you'd like.
It really is a clever and simplified notation system. Essentially, he was able to express mountains of math stuff with a mere four of five different symbols...which is at the heart of its brilliance, imho.

One of the reasons for it being called 'surreal' was that Conway's system of notation had a means to differentiate between values of infinity.

(you may now ask "Why is that significant, stanky?")

Well, love, I'm glad you asked...and you might be glad for the answer, because it appeals to logic:

(Honey? are you still awake?)

Here's classic, if simplistic example:

How many whole numbers are there? Easy. Infinite.
Now, how many prime numbers are there?
Easy. Infinite.
(Hopefully, you know what a prime number is. If not, I'll explain.)

So, what is the ratio of whole integers to prime numbers?
Easy:
one to one. Both being infinite.

Yet, obviously, primes are much more rare than all the normal numbers.
Hence, something is off, logically, in that one to one ratio.

And Conway's number system was able to address that. It could ascribe different values of infinity.

I can sense the objections of the hordes of imaginary lurkers, clinging to their pragmatic out look.
To them, all i can say is "your welcome".
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#12
I'm still awake but my brain is logging off and powering down fast.
I'll try and read that again in the morning.
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#13
I don't mean to torture you, Di.

After all, you're my hobby.
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#14
Well, I've heard of copping out before but this takes the cake stankster:

"One of the reasons I chose not to crush his argument was that there were too many choices of examples for me, and it simply wasn't worthy of my time. "

There were so many examples, you couldn't be bothered to link to just one?

You've reached a new level of lame my friend. Smile Carry on!
You can lead 'em to knowledge, but you can't make 'em think.
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#15
"I was just looking at a youtube on the site "numberphile" wherein there were four or more choices that mathematicians used as a symbol."

Well done. I stand corrected.
You can lead 'em to knowledge, but you can't make 'em think.
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#16
(04-19-2017, 07:21 PM)sparks Wrote:  Well, I've heard of copping out before but this takes the cake stankster:

"One of the reasons I chose not to crush his argument was that there were too many choices of examples for me, and it simply wasn't worthy of my time. "

There were so many examples, you couldn't be bothered to link to just one?

You've reached a new level of lame my friend.  Smile  Carry on!

Do i have to? I'll have to dig thru a heap of stuff because they don't have names. It could take me an hour.
If you start with Godel's incompleteness theorem and go from there, you'll run into some of them.
Maybe i'll do it tonight.

It could be worth it to get a 'well done' from you.
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#17
I'm a cruel man, but fair. Smile
You can lead 'em to knowledge, but you can't make 'em think.
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#18
(04-19-2017, 09:14 AM)stanky Wrote:  How timely, Sparky.In fact, it happened a few days ago here, when T.A. made some weird blanket statement (forgive me for not recalling it word for word) that asked something like "show me one example wherein math solutions come up with multiple solutions that are contradictory.
One of the reasons I chose not to crush his argument was that there were too many choices of examples for me, and it simply wasn't worthy of my time. If he's here, and can recall this moment, I will be glad to oblige.

I'm here alright. I've been in my sick bed with some fucking virus for a couple of days but I'm now ready to see your "evidence".

Away you go.

One algorithm, two or more answers...
Love is... that one person whose freshly-warm toilet seat you don't find disgusting.
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#19
You do realize you're giving me a homework assignment, right?
Yeah, I know the onus is supposed to be on the one making extraordinary claims, but in this case, the claim isn't extraordinary.
At some point, shouldn't the onus be on the one disclaiming the non extraordinary claim?

If i bother to do this digging, what is the prize?
Will I get a "well done" like Sparky gave me above?

Closing in on midnight here. maybe I'll do it in the morning. It's going to take a while. Not because it doesn't exist; because there aren't common names for the anomalies; not that I remember.

Still, I could surely find a few examples.
What concerns me is why you'd have a horse in the race of this not existing?
One of them gives an answer of zero or minus one; both equally valid and in contradiction.

Not sure why i would invent this sort of thing.
It's not like I've run out of imagination and now must resort to lies.
You know I'm fond of geeky math stuff, and have made many links here to that stuff.

wtf, i'll swallow that pride and dig it up.
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#20
(04-20-2017, 09:25 PM)stanky Wrote:  You do realize you're giving me a homework assignment, right?

Nope, you brought it on yourself, as explained by you right here:

(04-20-2017, 09:25 PM)stanky Wrote:  Yeah, I know the onus is supposed to be on the one making extraordinary claims, but in this case, the claim isn't extraordinary.

We'd be disagreeing on the amount of extraordinary it is, so I'll happily stick to the one making the claim being responsible for providing the evidence.

(04-20-2017, 09:25 PM)stanky Wrote:  At some point, shouldn't the onus be on the one disclaiming the non extraordinary claim?

No, never.

How could I possibly provide evidence for something I don't believe exists? Where would I even start looking?

You claimed it was easy to back your claim up, so go ahead an back it up.

(04-20-2017, 09:25 PM)stanky Wrote:  If i bother to do this digging, what is the prize?
Will I get a "well done" like Sparky gave me above?

A box of chocolate fish and my undying admiration of your brilliance.

(04-20-2017, 09:25 PM)stanky Wrote:  Closing in on midnight here. maybe I'll do it in the morning. It's going to take a while. Not because it doesn't exist; because there aren't common names for the anomalies; not that I remember.

It sounds to me like you're confusing incomplete or inadequate data with the same algorithm providing different answers. There was an interesting case a few years back of a young mathematician who solved a seemingly intractable problem.

Until research showed she was just mistaken.

(04-20-2017, 09:25 PM)stanky Wrote:  Still, I could surely find a few examples.

As with swans & crows, one will do.

(04-20-2017, 09:25 PM)stanky Wrote:  What concerns me is why you'd have a horse in the race of this not existing?

Because I'm a maths geek with lots of maths geek friends who are all far and away more advanced than me, and I've never heard of it.

(04-20-2017, 09:25 PM)stanky Wrote:  One of them gives an answer of zero or minus one; both equally valid and in contradiction.

I'm waiting with breath fully bated!
Love is... that one person whose freshly-warm toilet seat you don't find disgusting.
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